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Dr. Gary Steiner - A Vegan Diet is a Moral Obligation - P2/2
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I really want to
separate the question of
what people feel like doing
or what people think
they can accommodate
in their lives.
I want to separate
that kind of question
from what I think
is a moral question,
which is,
do we have a right?
Are we entitled
to eat animals?
And I want to be
very, very clear
that in my judgment
we don’t have that right.
Halo, intelligent viewers,
and welcome to
Animal World:
Our Co-Inhabitants.
On today's program,
we feature Part 2
our interview
with Dr. Gary Steiner,
a John Howard Harris
Professor of Philosophy
at Bucknell University,
USA and author
who calls himself
an “ethical vegan,”
meaning that he has
adopted a vegan lifestyle
because he believes
animals are sentient beings
and we have a moral duty
toward them.
He has written
several books including
“Descartes
as a Moral Thinker,”
“Anthropocentrism
and Its Discontents”
and his most recent work,
“Animals and
the Moral Community:
Mental Life, Moral Status,
and Kinship.”
Dr. Steiner now explains
why he uses the word
“moral” when discussing
the relationship between
animals and humans.
I think the reason
it's important here
is because
it carries a weight
that a lot of other words
that we might use
don't carry.
So, here's an example.
Sometimes people think:
you shouldn't
go out of your way
to be cruel to animals
but there's nothing
that you really owe them
in terms of
moral obligations.
But I think the idea
of a moral obligation
is something
that's very important.
To say that we have
a moral obligation
means there's something
like a brick wall there
that we're not supposed
to breach.
And I think once
we're able to say that
we have moral obligations
towards animals,
that's something like
a kind of armor
that animals get to wear
that says,
there are certain things
we must never ever do.
And I think that the notion
of a moral obligation
toward animals
is exactly that.
It's a very powerful
kind of commitment
that we ought to
recognize ourselves to have.
If we recognize
that animals and humans
are really comparable
to each other morally
then we have to recognize
that we have the same
sorts of obligations
of non-harm
and non-violence and
obligations of respect
toward animals that
we have toward humans.
Dr. Steiner explains that,
like humans, animals
have deep emotions and
a great capacity for love.
Pindar is a rescue cat.
I got him
a couple of years ago.
I wasn't really looking for
another cat.
I had had a couple of cats
for a long time and
I loved them very much
and had, what I felt was
a very, very intimate bond
with them.
A kind of bond that I think,
it was very much
like the bond
that many people have,
say with their children.
So, these two cats had
lived a long life with me
and they had both
recently passed away
of old age and then
this rescue cat
got sort of presented to me,
foisted upon me.
So I took this cat in and
after he got healthy again,
this wonderful
personality emerged.
And he turned out to be
this really, really gentle,
wonderful creature.
And I would say
that there is a kind of
love bond between us.
It seems very clear to me
that Pindar has a
loving feeling toward me.
And it might be
the kind of loving feeling
that a little child has
when it's two or three
or four years old
towards its parent.
I don't think
anybody would say
that little human children
are incapable of love
even though they can't
think about their love.
And I think that
what's going on in Pindar
is something like that.
And I think
in many animals
there's all sorts of signs
of affection and regard
that animals show
toward each other
and that they show
toward humans.
For many people there is
a sad contradiction
present in their relationship
with animals.
Dr. Steiner provides
his perspective
on this inconsistency.
It’s a very, very troubling
reality that there are
these contradictions and
conflicts in people’s lives.
The pet industry is a
multi-billion dollar industry
in the United States.
And people who have pets
quite often love them
almost like a family member,
and are very upset
when bad things
happen to their pets,
and if they are in a
financial position to do it,
will spend an enormous
amount of money
on their pets, on treats
and toys and
high quality food
and go to great lengths
to lavish love and
consideration on their pets.
So it’s particularly
conspicuous and troubling
that the very same people,
or many of
the very same people,
who love their pets,
are willing to gamble
on dog fighting,
or cockfighting show
a pretty blatant disregard
for animals, in being willing
to subject them
to experiments
that are pretty gruesome.
When we return,
we will learn more
from Dr. Gary Steiner
about the moral obligation
of humanity to
adopt the vegan lifestyle.
Please stay tuned
to Supreme Master
Television.
We need to be able to
find a way to articulate
clear principles about
the rights of animals,
not to be used
by human beings,
establishing clear legal
and moral principles
that tell us it’s wrong
to inflict violence or
inflict harm on animals.
Welcome back to
Animal World:
Our Co-Inhabitants
as we continue
our interview
with Dr. Gary Steiner,
a John Howard Harris
Professor of Philosophy
at Bucknell University,
USA, author,
and a pure vegan who
has chosen this lifestyle
for ethical reasons.
Cognitive dissonance is
a term from psychology
which describes
a condition where
anxiety is created when
there is a gulf between
what one believes
and one’s actual actions.
Previously Dr. Steiner gave
the example of people
who adore and
shower affection upon
their animal companions
being inconsistent when
they view other animals
as merely objects
for consumption,
experimentation
or entertainment.
They find themselves able
to turn a blind eye towards
what really goes on
in the production
of the meat that they eat
and so forth.
And I think
that there is a kind of
cognitive dissonance there.
They can’t
allow themselves to
acknowledge the reality
of what goes on.
And also they’re coming
out of a very, very long
history of practices,
such as meat eating.
So I have not infrequently
encountered people
who’ve said: “Boy,
I’ve heard that the way
that veal is raised,
or the way
that chickens are raised,
or the way
that pigs are raised,
is kind of gruesome.
So I don’t really want to
know anymore about that.”
I think the only thing
that’s going to get people
to overcome that sort of
contradiction or tension,
is a willingness
to look at the facts
and really think about
the inconsistencies
in their own behavior.
That thinking
has to get to the point of
altering our feelings,
so that when I start
to think about the fact
that the food on my plate
is essentially
the same as me, it might
make me feel differently
about eating that food.
Only when that happens,
I think will people really
recognize this contradiction
and try to resolve it.
In Dr. Stein’s view what
is our foremost obligation
in fulfilling our moral
duties toward animals?
I think
that we have obligations
toward animals.
Our obligation,
I think first of all is
to lead a vegan lifestyle
at the very minimum.
There's no justification
for inflicting the terrible
harms that things
like factory farming
and experimentation
on animals and
all sorts of other things
that we do.
So from square one,
I think the first thing
that we have
is an obligation
not to harm animals,
not to exercise violence
or visit violence upon them.
And the, the most
straightforward way to
understand that obligation
is to become vegan
and to stay vegan.
So being a vegan I think
is a very important thing.
On December 1, 2009,
the Lisbon Treaty
came into effect
and per Article 13
the European Union now
formally recognizes all
animals as sentient beings.
We asked Dr. Steiner
about the role of
government in regulating
the relationship between
humans and animals.
Professor Francione at
Rutgers (University USA)
argues that
if it were possible
through legislation
to abolish the property
status of animals,
that’s the single
most important thing
that either government or
the law or the legislation
could do.
Because
in the Anglo-American
legal tradition
going back centuries,
animals have been
classified as property,
they are things that we own;
they’re chattel.
And that enables people
to do all sort of things
because you can destroy
your own property.
It might not be
a smart thing to do,
but there is no law
prohibiting you
from doing it.
And that means
you can raise animals
and kill them
for human consumption,
you can sell them,
you can use them, you
can experiment on them.
If it were ever possible
to classify animals
legally as non-property,
as something
like legal persons, then
that would prevent people
from killing animals,
experimenting on them
and so forth.
It would essentially put
animals in the situation
of really being
considered morally
comparable to
human beings, in the sense
that if you can’t do it
to a human being, you’re
not going to be allowed
to do it to an animal.
I think that’s the best thing
that either government
or legislation
could possibly do
is abolish the property
status of animals.
According to Dr. Steiner,
if we truly care
for our planet,
each one of us must take
personal responsibility
to lead more thoughtful
and conscientious lives.
I think all the things that
we do that inflict violence
upon animals in nature
and perhaps to ecosystems,
that’s something
that we have to think
very, very carefully about.
So anytime,
I buy something
that involves packaging,
things like that or anytime
I consume something
that’s going to end up
polluting the waterways
or wetlands, I have to be
thinking very carefully
about all of those things.
But square one,
the starting point,
I think, is our relation to
sentient life, to animal life.
And I think the first thing
that most people can do,
is to become vegan.
And be a strict vegan.
Be Veg,
Go Green,
Save the Planet.
We deeply thank
Dr. Gary Steiner
and all those like him
who not only
live the vegan lifestyle,
but also seek to raise
the awareness of others
regarding our moral duty
toward our animal friends,
thus saving
countless numbers
of their precious lives.
We look forward to
the day soon in coming
where all sentient beings
on Earth
live in harmony and peace.
For more details
on Dr. Steiner,
please visit
www.FacStaff.Bucknell.edu/GSteiner
Books by Dr. Steiner
are available on
Amazon.com
Thank you for joining us
today on Animal World:
Our Co-Inhabitants.
Coming up next is
Enlightening Entertainment
right after
Noteworthy News,
here on
Supreme Master Television.
May joy and tenderness
fill your heart each day.
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